Global China Chat on tourism, transcript 2
16:22 | Fons Tuinstra: Welcome at the Global China Chat on tourism with Roy Graff, who will join us shortly from London. The GCC is hosted by Maria Korolov of the China Speakers Bureau. Our chat will start shortly. In case your screen does not update regularly, please press F5 to refresh your window. |
16:22 |  fonstuinstra: The 2nd Global China Chat on tourism is now live and testing to start at the full hour www.chinaherald.net |
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16:27 | Fons Tuinstra: Next clip about Chinese tourists to Taiwan |
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16:28 | [Comment From Roy Graff] hi please let me in |
16:29 | Fons Tuinstra: And now a bit of China promotion |
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16:30 | Roy Graff: i am here. |
16:30 | Maria Korolov: Good morning! |
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16:31 | Maria Korolov: Oops, sorry, didn't mean to close that out on you. |
| 16:32 | [Ad] | China Speakers Bureau View |
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16:38 | Fons Tuinstra: Next, Chinese tourists to the US |
16:44 | fonstuinstra: Started our pre-chat show at the Global China Chat on tourism www.chinaherald.net |
16:47 | Fons Tuinstra: Welcome at our chat. we will officially start at the full hour |
16:47 | Fons Tuinstra: Welcome at the Global China Chat on tourism with Roy Graff, who will join us shortly from London. The GCC is hosted by Maria Korolov of the China Speakers Bureau. Our chat will start shortly. In case your screen does not update regularly, please press F5 to refresh your window. |
16:49 | Fons Tuinstra: Maria Korolov |
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16:49 | Fons Tuinstra: RG Profile |
16:49 | Fons Tuinstra: Roy Graff |
16:50 | Maria Korolov: Thank you, Fons |
16:50 | Fons Tuinstra: Welcome at the Global China Chat on tourism with Roy Graff, who will join us shortly from London. The GCC is hosted by Maria Korolov of the China Speakers Bureau. Our chat will start shortly. In case your screen does not update regularly, please press F5 to refresh your window. |
16:51 |  chinacontact: about to start the 2nd global China chat on tourism www.chinaherald.net |
16:52 |  Mariakorolov: Hosting the Global China Chat on tourism:www.chinaherald.net |
16:53 | MariaKorolov: Hosting the Global China Chat on tourism:www.chinaherald.net |
16:55 | Fons Tuinstra: Welcome at the Global China Chat on tourism with Roy Graff, who will join us shortly from London. The GCC is hosted by Maria Korolov of the China Speakers Bureau. Our chat will start shortly. In case your screen does not update regularly, please press F5 to refresh your window. |
16:55 | Maria Korolov: Good morning, everybody. We will start the Global China Chat on Tourism in five minutes. |
17:01 | Maria Korolov: Good morning! |
17:01 | Maria Korolov: My name is Maria Korolov, and I'm the moderator of today's Global Chat on China Tourism. Before I introduce our speaker, I'd like to thank Fons Tuinstra, the head of the China Speakers Bureau, for organizing this event. |
17:01 | Maria Korolov: Fons is also handling the multimedia for this presentation. Thank you, Fons, for being here today. |
17:02 | Maria Korolov: Now I would like to introduce a recognized expert in China tourism and hospitality, Roy Graff. He is one of our speakers in the China Speakers Bureau. |
17:02 | Maria Korolov: Roy is the founder of ChinaContact, an online resource containing tourism information and services for China. |
17:02 | Maria Korolov: Roy has focused his career on e-commerce, online travel and hospitality in China. He fouded ChinaContact in 2005, after gaining extensive business experience and insight while working in both Beijing and Shanghai. |
17:02 | Maria Korolov: Roy has a bachelor’s degree in Chinese and Economics from the School of Oriental and African Studies, University of London. His vast knowledge of Chinese culture, language and business practices stem from his work in academia as well as the public and private sectors. |
| 17:02 | Given today's economic climate, how important do you think Chinese tourists are to the international tourism industry? Very important ( 50% ) ( 50% ) ( 0% ) ( 0% ) |
17:02 | Maria Korolov: Roy has bridged China tourism consulting with various travel and hospitality ventures in China, including a flagship forum on tourism in China, “China the Future of Travel,” held annually at the World Travel Market in London. Additionally, Roy is a Director of China Business Services and European Director of China Venture Capital and Private Equity Forum in London, and a founding member of China Advisers Network (C.A.N.), an association of leading China specalists and advisers from various disciplines in the UK. |
17:03 | Maria Korolov: I will be moderating today's questions – we will try to get to everybody, please be patient. |
17:03 | Maria Korolov: Thank you Roy, for joining us here today! |
17:04 | Roy Graff: Hi everyone, great to be here again. We had a very good morning session and I hope to repeat that success now. Hopefully we will get more US based viewers to ask us questions |
17:04 | Maria Korolov: We already have some questions cued up from our guests. |
17:04 | Maria Korolov: But before we get to the questions, Roy, can you please introduce your topic? |
17:05 | Fons Tuinstra: China outbound travel handbook |
17:05 | Roy Graff: Tourism is a very new and fragmented sector in China that has a long way to go before it matures.As such, early entrants stand to benefit greatly. Especially when you consider the culture of doing business in China, which values long term commitment and established relationships. |
17:05 | Fons Tuinstra: RG China Contact |
17:05 | Roy Graff: I am happy to answer questions pertaining to china outbound tourism, China domestic travel and China inbound. |
17:06 | [Comment From Jason Kucherawy] Greetings! |
17:06 | [Comment From karl ziegler] Mary good day |
17:06 | Roy Graff: As well as re China's online travel environment and the hotel sector |
17:06 | Roy Graff: Opportunities for foreign companies exist in outbound and inbound tourism. Mainly as the services sectors in China are being opened up now as part of the WTO commitments by China. UN-WTO new Secretary General has said at ITB that China intends to push outbound tourism to double it's current numbers by 2013 |
17:07 | Maria Korolov: Roy, have the tourists travelling out of China grown recently? |
17:07 | Roy Graff: Dr. Taleb Rifai of UN-WTO: “Chinese government representatives told me: We will work hard to double the number of Chinese Outbound Travellers in the next four to five years!” Given the current level of 46 million cross-border travels from Mainland China in 2008, this would translate to about 90 million travels in 2013 |
17:07 | Roy Graff: They are still growing though at a slower pace than before the financial crisis. It is having an effect. |
17:07 | [Comment From Krista Bolles] Hello everyone |
17:08 | Fons Tuinstra: Decline in inbound/outbound tourists 2008 |
17:08 | Maria Korolov: Thank you Fons for the numbers. |
17:09 | Roy Graff: Travelling is a big deal for Chinese, and doubly so when travelling abroad. The freedom to travel to Europe without the need for official permission is the beginning of an era for the tourism industry. Tourism, however, is not a new phenomenon. Under the pretext of business of official delegations, hundreds of thousands of Chinese have visited Europe in the past decade. Historically, travelling abroad was often based on “friendly relations” with other countries. Until the late eighties, the world was divided into two camps engaged in cold war. During this period, China made a clear distinction between friendly nations and adversaries. Officials were allowed to travel abroad only upon official invitation to enhance friendly relations. Travel was therefore very much limited to officials and seen as a great privilege. With the fall of the Berlin Wall, the consequent change in world order, and economic reforms in China, outbound travel moved from being the privilege of officials to a business necessity. As disposable income and leisure time increases, it is now becoming a part of ordinary people’s lives for pleasure and education. However, visiting other countries is still regarded as an exchange of friendship and goodwill. This cultural background can influence the expectations of Chinese travellers. One often still feels honoured or privileged to travel abroad and expects a corresponding hospitality from the hosts. With the changing times, privileged Chinese visitors are not necessarily received ceremoniously; rather, they are often treated as a cash cow. Frequently, Chinese visitors are disappointed in the level of service and hospitality they find in Europe. To experience Western society firsthand is very much a culture shock. Europe is not the hypermodern society they have expected compared to China, which has always depicted itself as backward and poor. |
17:10 | Roy Graff: Excerpt from the China Outbound Travel Handbook. A free resource available online to learn the basics of the Chinese outbound travel market. |
17:10 | [Comment From Guest] Hi Roy, I was wondering how you feel the economic slowdown has affected China's outbound tourism market, particularly in comparison with other countries |
17:10 | Fons Tuinstra: China's impact on global tourism |
| 17:11 | What is the main obstacle in receiving Chinese tourists to your destination? lack of awareness or promotio ( 33% ) ( 0% ) ( 0% ) ( 67% ) ( 0% ) |
17:11 | Roy Graff: Not as much as other countries. The base is still small and the middle class is still growing. The main constraint on outbound travel comes from: visa application, lack of awareness of destinations, cost. |
17:11 | [Comment From Guest] What impact have visa requirements and restrictions had on outbound travel from China lately? Many Chinese are facing difficulty obtaining visas to visit other countries, is that right? |
17:11 | Roy Graff: And this is the case regardless of the economy. Business travel is affected more, but there is still scope with the right promotion and product offering. |
17:12 | Roy Graff: Chinese always face difficulty. a lot of the problem comes from communication- not enough help to complete the application, errors in the process etc. Also the need for face to face interviews is an obstacle |
17:13 | [Comment From Jeremy Gordon] Ref Chinese visas, isn't it now easier for people to go to Hong Kong? How far is this helping hte industry there? |
17:13 | Roy Graff: Countries that realise this will get more visitors if they go towards the Chinese. Malaysia is offering visa waver, Guam wants to also wave visa requirements (but limited by the US) |
17:14 | Roy Graff: HKG has been saved by the Chinese market. visitors from other places dropped significantly and only the Chinese are propping up its tourist economy. |
17:14 | Roy Graff: they do not need visa to HKG, just a permit. |
17:14 | [Comment From Guest] How is China's outbound tourism market doing relative to its inbound and domestic travel markets? |
17:14 | Roy Graff: and HKG also accepts RMB (albeit at a 1=1 exchange rate which is unfair to the Chinese) |
17:15 | Roy Graff: it is much smaller, but has a higher growth rate |
17:15 | Maria Korolov: Roy, one of our guests has asked if China has its own version of Expedia for booking travel online? |
17:16 | Roy Graff: Well the model is not yet popular in China. online travel accounts for a very small percentage of total travel bookings and is dominated by Ctrip, Nasdaq listed. |
17:16 | Roy Graff: Expedia ownds eLong, the second runner up in China for online travel. |
17:17 | Roy Graff: However the transaction model relies heavily on call centers and cash payments |
17:17 | Fons Tuinstra: But the importance of Ctrip seems to grow or not? |
17:17 | Fons Tuinstra: I book all my hotels in China over Ctrip |
17:17 | Roy Graff: http://chinacontacttourism.ning.com/group/onlinetravel for more on online travel |
17:18 | Roy Graff: I think Ctrip are good in combining the best of online marketing with the Chinese cultural aspects of not trusting online merchants. |
17:18 | Maria Korolov: Roy, is the problem a lack of credit cards and online payment? Or just because the Internet is new? |
17:18 | Roy Graff: and they have started at the right time in the development of this sector. |
17:19 | Roy Graff: lack of credit cards, lack of trust and preference for local, trusted brand names |
17:19 | Roy Graff: The fact that Ctrip is so dominant is in itself a problem and shows the market is not mature. |
17:19 | Maria Korolov: Earlier today, several people were asking about how China is opening up to foreign firms, and I see that we're getting some of those questions again. |
17:20 | [Comment From Guest] How easy is it for a foreigner to operate a tourism company in China? What are the restrictions on this? |
17:20 | Roy Graff: As with most legal issues in China this is not straightforward answer. |
17:20 | [Comment From Guest] Are most travel agencies more or less forced to partner with Chinese companies in order to conduct business in China and comply with domestic laws? |
| 17:20 | Do you think foreign companies have chances in China's tourism industry? Yes ( 60% ) ( 0% ) ( 40% ) |
17:20 | Roy Graff: very briefly, foreign firms cannot operate an outbound travel company in China |
17:21 | Roy Graff: but that does not mean you have to go into JV (joint venture) anymore. |
17:21 | Roy Graff: the options are: representative office, WOFE as consulting or technology company, or establish an inbound travel company first and wait 2 years to gain the outbound license. |
17:22 | Roy Graff: this last one, is based on new regulations coming into effect 1 May but how it will happen in practice is still anyone's guess. |
17:22 | Fons Tuinstra: Are there any capital requirements to set up such a business, and is that a problem? |
17:22 | Roy Graff: Those companies that have setup their inbound travel business a few years ago in China will be the first to benefit. |
17:22 | Fons Tuinstra: New regulations on May 1 |
17:22 | [Comment From Guest] Are most travel agencies in China focused on inbound or outbound travel? More and more Chinese are able to travel abroad these days; nevertheless, the amount of domestic travel has been increasing as well, right? What are your thoughts on this? |
17:22 | Roy Graff: capital requirements exist for any company, depending on your business activities and scope of business, the capital varies. |
17:23 | Roy Graff: all agents in China that are licensed, are licensed to do domestic/inbound travel. Outbound travel is a separate license. |
17:23 | Maria Korolov: Question from Zelia Breda: Are Chinese outbound travel limited to authorised travel agencies only? |
17:23 | Roy Graff: overwhelming number is engages in domestic travel only. From 1 May these companies can also offer inbound travel. |
17:24 | Roy Graff: less than 900 travel agencies have the outbound license. |
17:24 | Roy Graff: officially, only licensed operators can sell outbound travel for groups of minimum 5 people including a tour leader. |
17:25 | Roy Graff: this is under the ADS rules (approved destination status)http://www.chinacontact.org/information/ads.html |
17:25 | Roy Graff: for business/education/individual travel, a license is not required |
17:25 | Maria Korolov: We will take a short break in five minutes for a video, then we will talk about inbound travel during the second half of the chat. |
17:25 | Roy Graff: However like in other countries, to sell packages with flights you need IATA license and bonding. |
17:26 | Fons Tuinstra: So, most to business, education or individual travel to avoid the license? |
17:26 | Maria Korolov: Meanwhile, if there are any other outbound-travel-related questions, please post them now. |
17:26 | Roy Graff: many do that, avoiding the ADS license and applying for business visas for their customers. |
17:27 | Fons Tuinstra: An receiving countries are happy with that? |
17:27 | Roy Graff: if you want to be kept up to date on china outbound tourism, visit out website to register for the monthly newsletter. Destinations are very slow to catch up with the adaptability of Chinese agents... |
17:28 | Roy Graff: they think that it is easier to control illegal immigration if all Chinese come in tour groups. |
17:28 | [Comment From Guest] What are various countries doing to attract Chinese tourists? Are these efforts primarily focused on relaxing visa requirements? |
17:28 | Roy Graff: but many Chinese want independent travel and will find a way to do that. If a destination does not play along, they will go somewhere else. |
17:29 | Roy Graff: I wish more will relax visa requirements. Japan will start giving individual visas to wealthy Chinese, based on their bank balance. |
17:29 | Roy Graff: Mexico is thinking to waive the visa. |
17:29 | Roy Graff: mostly countries engage in trade promotion, road shows, agent training. some also do outdoors media advertising. Television promotion through travel shows also helps. |
17:30 | Maria Korolov: thank you, Roy! |
17:30 | Maria Korolov: We will now take a short break for a video about Chinese tourism. |
17:31 | Fons Tuinstra: Tourism in China |
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17:31 | Roy Graff: PS. if people want to send me a private message they can do so at http://network.chinacontact.org, through the chat module. |
17:35 | chinacontact: If any of my twitter followers reading the global China chat on tourism, pls let me know. |
17:35 | Maria Korolov: Thank you, Fons, for this video! |
17:35 | Maria Korolov: Lots of places to go see in China. |
17:35 | Maria Korolov: Roy, can you tell us more about the inbound tourism market? |
| 17:36 | How is the number of international trips to China, hotel occupation rate, holding after the 2008 Beijing Olympics? Going down ( 75% ) ( 25% ) ( 0% ) ( 0% ) |
17:37 | Roy Graff: Last year, the Olympic year, was not great for inbound tourism. There was a restriction placed on Visas to China from last April or so, which deterred many non-Olympics related travel throughout the year. the Olympics effect is also well documented to reduce tourism because of concern about higher costs and crowding |
17:37 | [Comment From Guest] What difficulties have foreigners been facing recently in obtaining visas to China? Have visa requirements tightened since the Beijing Olympics, and has this had a significant impact on inbound travel to China? |
17:37 | Roy Graff: but I want to focus on the opportunities that exist now. Because tourism is down this year, many places are cheaper and more friendly to tourists. |
17:38 | Fons Tuinstra: Flexible checkout for Shanghai hotels |
17:38 | Roy Graff: last year before the Olympics, visas became difficult to obtain and this is repeating itself now because of the World Expo 2010. |
17:38 | Fons Tuinstra: Tibet open for foreign tourists |
17:38 | Fons Tuinstra: Visa-free thru Hainan |
17:38 | [Comment From Guest] How has the earthquake in Sichuan affected tourism to that area of the country? |
17:39 | Roy Graff: Providing you follow the application procedure you can get a visa, the main problem is for expats living in China that want to extend their visa or work in China without an official sponsor. |
17:39 | Fons Tuinstra: Tourism in Hangzhou |
17:40 | Roy Graff: the earthquake led to almost zero tourism for more than 6 months and it is now coming back. It is worth going there again now but you have to be careful and know where to go as not all areas have been rebuilt. |
17:40 | [Comment From Guest] Have less traditional, more off-the-beaten path tours in China been gaining in popularity recently or are major cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Xian still China's primary draws? |
17:40 | Roy Graff: People in Sichuan rely heavily on tourism and need this income. |
| 17:41 | What is your feeling about the consumer confidence in China? High ( 0% ) ( 100% ) ( 0% ) |
17:41 | Roy Graff: on the whole the main attractions are stil Beijing, Xian, Shanghai and then Guilin. But there are many attractions that are easier to get to now more than ever, like Sichuan (Chengdu, Jiuzhaigou, Wolong), Yunnan (Shangrila, Dali, Lijiang, Xishuangbanna), Guizhou, Gansu... |
17:42 | Roy Graff: it is not longer just for the adventurous. but requires more time and patience. |
17:42 | [Comment From Guest] Will the Expo in 2010 increase or decrease tourism in China? |
| 17:43 | Is the Expo 2010 going to be a big draw for international visitors? Yes ( 40% ) ( 60% ) |
17:44 | Roy Graff: The Expo is over 6 months so unlike the Beijing Olympics is not such a disruptive event. It will draw more visitors for Asia. I don't think it will draw many more from the West. People who go to China from the West want to see China, not other countries. and Shanghai represents China like New York represents the US... |
17:44 | [Comment From Guest] Can you explain briefly the conflict over official number of holiday days in China this year, and ultimately will the number of official Chinese holidays affect the domestic tourism market? |
17:44 | Roy Graff: Last year the policy regarding holidays changed, to reflect a move away from overcrowding and pressure on attractions during the 3 'golden weeks' |
17:45 | Roy Graff: so from last year you have a shorter May holiday and extra 2 long weekend holidays |
17:45 | Roy Graff: the result is that more people choose to travel within China or short haul outbound travel. there is no culture of paid-holiday in most companies.Only the multinationals, Joint venture ones offer this, usually 12 days a year. |
17:46 | Roy Graff: the conflict happened this time because an official from CNTA (China National Tourist Administration) announced that due to the economic crisis, provinces can decide if they wish to reinstate the original May day one week holiday. |
17:46 | Roy Graff: some provinces took up the offer only to be told by the State Council to stick to the original plan! |
17:46 | Maria Korolov: That must have upset a lot of travel plans! |
17:46 | Roy Graff: highly political and not really about what is good for the industry. |
17:46 | [Comment From Guest] Is Homestay going to be promoted in China as it has been elsewhere around SE Asia? |
17:47 | Roy Graff: yes it has. and now some companies (that are not that busy anyway in South China) may offer this as paid holiday, so travel agents are keeping their products. |
17:47 | Roy Graff: Homestay was promoted for the Olympics but was not used very much because hotels had plenty of space. |
17:48 | [Comment From Guest] Has Shanghai, the "New York" of China, been attracting more tourists than Beijing in the last few years, and do you think this will change in the near future? |
17:48 | Roy Graff: language remains a problem though to increase this offer across China. |
17:48 | Roy Graff: No Beijing is the major draw. Shanghai has very little to offer tourists from abroad. it is mainly a commercial centre and attracts Chinese tourists that want to see the modern face of China |
17:49 | [Comment From Guest] Is mainland China a big draw for residents of Hong Kong, or is it the other way around? |
17:49 | Roy Graff: both. HKG people have been coming to China for many years. for the Mainland Chinese, a visit to HKG is still relatively a novel experience. |
17:49 | [Comment From Guest] What are the most up and coming destinations within China currently? Do you see western China attracting more tourists in the near future? |
17:50 | Roy Graff: watch Western China carefully. after the earthquake, tourism to Sichuan and nearby provinces was hit but it is now coming back and tourism plays a very important role in the recovery and rebuilding effort. Sichuan, Yunnan have so much to offer to the tourist in terms of scenery, minority cultures, food etc. and the weather is pretty good. Also Guizhou, Gansu are not very developed and offer a very good insight into the 'other' China |
17:50 | Roy Graff: Xinjiang/Tibet are harder to travel in but worth the effort if you do it right with specialist operators. |
17:50 | [Comment From Guest] Has Macau become a popular domestic travel attraction, or has the island targeted foreigners more than the local Chinese population? |
17:51 | Roy Graff: The Silk Road journey is very interesting. China has something for everyone but you should consult a specialist and not just join a standard group that will cover the same attractions. |
17:51 | Roy Graff: The island started by relying on Chinese but the government now restricts Chinese from going to Macau because so many officials and business people spent too much money there... |
17:51 | Roy Graff: so now Chinese can only travel once every 3 months. Macau is suffering as a result |
17:52 | [Comment From Guest] Do you think there are a big differences between Chinese young adults who were born after 80 and 90 in terms of their travel behaviours? |
17:52 | Roy Graff: some building of new hotels and casinos has been halted. |
17:52 | Roy Graff: do you mean difference between those born in 80s and those born in 90s? |
17:52 | [Comment From Guest] yes |
17:54 | Roy Graff: i think the main difference is between the people born after 1979 and those before. There is the one child policy, the amazing pace of reform and growth, the choice of education and career... all not available to the older generations. |
17:54 | [Comment From Guest] Continuing on that thread, are their major differences in domestic travel preferences of different age groups in China? |
17:54 | Roy Graff: this has a profound effect on travel choice and behaviour. Younger people are less concerned with saving all their money, are not used to hardships. |
17:55 | Maria Korolov: We have five more minutes before this chat ends -- time to get in a couple more questions before we go. |
17:55 | Roy Graff: the younger generation prefers to travel with friends, arranging their own travel online and researching online. they don't want to join tour groups. the older generation still relies on tour packages sold through travel agents |
17:55 | [Comment From Guest] Are the younger generations more inclined to travel than the older and more thrifty Chinese? |
17:55 | Fons Tuinstra: In Europe most older Chinese tourist seem to come from the US not from China |
17:56 | Roy Graff: no both groups want to travel. the older generation including retired people have savings and are very keen to see the world. but they prefer organised groups. |
17:56 | Maria Korolov: Roy, do you have your own favorite destination inside China? |
17:56 | Roy Graff: they have different preferences for activities naturally. but there are opportunities in all demographics. |
17:57 | Roy Graff: I would say Yunnan is my favourite province but I also love the climbing scene in and around Yangshuo, Guangxi |
17:57 | [Comment From Guest] Is visiting family in more rural areas of the country favored by China's older generations over trips to major metropolitan cities in China |
17:58 | Roy Graff: during the Chinese spring festival most people return to their ancestral homes to visit relatives. They use October holiday and May day holiday for travelling to other places. older people prefer cultural experiences, for example visiting Xian. |
17:58 | Roy Graff: Shanghai is relatively expensive destination within China. |
17:58 | Maria Korolov: Roy, that will have to be our last question, since we are running out of time. |
17:58 | Maria Korolov: Can you please tell people how to reach you and your company if they have more questions? |
17:59 | Roy Graff: I am on LinkedIn, Twitter, Viadeo, Plaxo, FriendFeed...and ChinaContact Tourism Network is the place to get advice -http://network.chinacontact.org |
17:59 | Fons Tuinstra: RG China Contact |
17:59 | Fons Tuinstra: RG Profile |
17:59 | Fons Tuinstra: RG weblog |
17:59 | Maria Korolov: Thank you, Roy! You are certainly connected! |
17:59 | Maria Korolov: And thank you for taking the time to join us to today and to answer all these questions. |
17:59 | Roy Graff: The network allows anyone to register for free, post a profile and access resources, including topical groups, the CHina Outbound Travel Handbook and ask questions. |
18:00 | Maria Korolov: Thank you Fos, for organizing this. And I'd also like to thank Krista Bolles for her research. |
18:00 | Roy Graff: Great experience, though my hands are tired now... |
18:00 | Maria Korolov: Good bye, everyone! |
18:00 | Maria Korolov: We will leave you with an audio tape of a recent interview of Roy. |
18:01 | [Comment From Guest] Thanks very much to Roy, Maria Korolov and Fons Tuinstra for hosting this online forum today. |
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18:11 | MariaKorolov: You can read the entire transcript of the China Tourism Chat here: http://china-speakers-bureau.com/blog/ |
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